Today’s interview is with Ashley Turner. After graduating from UAB’s PA program, Ashley works as a full-time surgery PA with a background in nutrition. Ashley also does nutrition coaching through Faster Way to Fat Loss (which I did, and loved). We talk about our experiences in PA school, how to make good choices, and how to get back on track.
This episode also has a podcast which you can listen to here.
Ashley: Hi everyone! I'm Ashley Turner. I'm a certified PA, and I work in Campbellsville, Kentucky, which is a small rural community where I grew up. I’ve been working in general surgery since graduating PA school. I live with my husband and 14 month old son, and all my family is here. I also do virtual health coaching with The FASTer Way to Fat Loss as well. So that's kind of me in a nutshell!
Savanna: How long have you been a PA?
Ashley: I graduated in December of 2014.
Savanna: We’re about the same because I graduated August of 2014! What was your background before PA school?
Ashley: I graduated from University of Kentucky with a Bachelor's of Science in Nutrition and Food Science. I wanted to go to PA school right after school, and I had my heart set on UAB. I always wanted to do surgery. So I applied only there following undergrad, and I did not get in. That was a huge blow to the ego! But that’s okay. I ended up taking a year off and I worked a lot of odd jobs. I worked as a nurse tech, doing triage at different clinics around Birmingham, Alabama. I actually moved there. I also cheered in college, so I became a cheerleading coach at UAB. And I also was a cheerleading coach in an all-star group down there as well. So I was working like three to four jobs during the entire year. Then I reapplied to UAB as well as another program in Nashville, Trevecca Nazarene University. I secured an interview at Trevecca, but did not get in. But at UAB, I got an interview and got accepted that second time, which I was really excited about! And it all worked out because I'm from Kentucky, and moving down there for a year and taking that leap of faith to reapply actually got me in-state tuition, which was helpful in the long run.
Savanna: That is a really big move! And I think a lot of people wouldn’t necessarily be willing to do that even if they really want to go to a particular school, and UAB is on the top of a lot of people’s list.
Ashley: I really sing the praises of UAB; I had a really good experience. I think you can find faults in every PA program. You can really nit-pick any program. But you know, I really can't find many. The staff was just really great. All the educators were just really wonderful. Setting up our rotations were huge. And they had just a lot of great resources and a lot of great preceptors. So I have no qualms about UAB. It definitely does speak volumes when applying to jobs because people will interview me and ask me about my training at UAB. And I've had people specifically asked for “UAB-trained PAs”. It was just really great. So I love my program, and I'm glad I did take the leap of faith to move down there and work my tail off for a year.
Savanna: I also love surgery! I think if I did not do derm, then I would do surgery. Are you actually in the OR? What does your job look like on a daily basis?
Ashley: I'm currently not in the OR in this current job, as much as my previous jobs. So I don't know if this is a good or bad thing, but this is my fourth job right now. So in my first job, that was level II trauma center and acute care, my vascular and general surgery job, my priority is pretty much the OR. I did a lot of critical care. We really acted as first year residents. We had the pagers. We were first-call for any issues on the floor. We also rotated doing floor call, critical care call, and trauma call. So we responded to the trauma codes, and we would also be first assisting in the OR. That was really exciting. I got to do a lot of procedures - A-lines, central lines, chest tubes, thoracentesis, and I was learning therapeutic bronchoscopies towards the end. So it was really awesome! In my vascular and general surgery group, my first priority was the OR as well. We first assisted the majority of the time and rounded on patients. At my current job, I do a little bit of it all. I rotate in the hospital. I do a clinic for two weeks. And I do a little bit of OR. I round on patients and do consults in the hospital.
Savanna: Okay, cool. So what are your hours like?
Ashley: So there are 3 PAs in our service. We rotate two weeks stints in either the clinic with more hospital, or we have a float two weeks where you have a little bit of an easier schedule with some mornings off during the week if the load is light in the hospital. Coming off the hospital two weeks is a little gruesome because we are pretty much there 7am - 5pm Monday through Friday. Sometimes you can go home early, it just really depends on the workload, the patient load. You kind of have to be there in case consults come in because you are the first one to respond to consults. But in clinic, it's pretty much 8 am - 5 pm, and we have a half-day on Fridays. So it kind of rotates. It's been pretty nice. It's been nice for work life balance for me having a new child.
Savanna: What is your level of autonomy and your relationship with your supervising physicians?
Ashley: It has changed a bit. It’s gotten a little less autonomous as I’ve gone through my jobs. In my trauma job, they pretty much let you go. For chest tubes, I saw one, did one, and then went to the floor and did one by myself. The trauma surgeon looked at me and said, “You can do this, right?” And I was like, “Hmmm yep!” So I marched to the floor by myself with a student, and that was really the second time I put a chest tube in. That was quite terrifying, because my patient was awake on the floor in stable condition. So it was terrifying because they were very alert! So in my practice, if I ever needed them, they were a call away. They trained us very well. The other PA who trained us trained us very well, and they were there every step of the way. I saw a lot of chest tubes before I did that. They were just very good at feeling the situation and knowing when they needed to be there, and knowing when they felt confident in my ability with all the PAs. They did a wonderful job at maintaining the relationship between the supervising physician in the PA.
Being in a small practice in a small town, it just makes it a little bit complicated, because everybody knows everyone. So you're pretty much seeing your patients at Church or at the Mexican restaurant in town and you don’t have that luxury because patients want to see the surgeon. They want to see your physician because that's who they're seeing out in the community. Midlevels are still a little bit new in a smaller, more rural community. So it's just a little bit different, but they still do a really good job of incorporating us into the practice.
Savanna: Interesting! So what made you interested in nutrition? Like, why did you choose that as a major? And was it helpful for PA school?
Ashley: Yes, I would say yes, to PA school, and also my career now. First of all, I was a biology major, but I hated coming out of the class and not really being able to apply it to my everyday life. And that really frustrated me that I spent all this hours learning things. And I was just like, “I want to just do something with this now. I want to learn something that I feel like I can apply to my life now.” And all through four years of college, I was a collegiate cheerleader. So being in shape, being at an appropriate size for our sport was very important. My sister was a nutrition major, and I would be kind of in the mix with her seeing what she was learning. I thought it was really awesome, what you’ve learned in class could apply to your life. You can build upon it and just continue on for the rest of your life! So I switched my degree to nutrition, and I ended up loving it. It helped me through my fitness level in college and where I needed to be and wanting to be.
And as far as being a PA right now in our General Surgery Clinic, again, bring in a rural community, we do a lot of primary care through our clinic. So I think in a lot of larger communities, when patients come to your general surgery clinic, they pretty much already come with the diagnosis, and they come with a plan of action, what you're going to do. They have the appropriate studies ordered, and you pretty much know their problem and know your plan of action really before you see the patient, a lot of the times. But here, they come in a lot with vague symptoms and get shuttled to us to kind of figure out and decipher between their symptoms. And a lot of times, it's nutritional things. It’s IBS. It’s constipation. It’s diarrhea that is diet-related. It’s lactose intolerance. It’s gluten sensitivities. We coach people through that. We have a surgeon I work with Dr. Bahr, and he’s very sweet. People will come in with these complaints, and he’s like “She's the expert, please talk to her. Just listen to what she says.” So I’ll come in and counsel people through these things, even with people with diabetes who are so lost and clueless. So it's been really great. It's been really helpful in this environment!
Savanna: That’s an interesting way to think about it, because yeah, my biology degree was useless haha. Okay, so we’ve never really talked about this on the podcast at all -- staying healthy in PA school! I don't necessarily think I did a great job of this. It’s really hard in the thick of it, and you’re just trying to survive. You're not necessarily thinking about what you're eating, or if you're eating or if you're working out because school is such a big priority. So do you think you did a good job of taking care of yourself and your health during PA school?
Ashley: I think I stayed active. I don't know if my diet was quite as tight as I would want it to be. But I think I've stayed fairly active, which was huge. My first year PA school, I was still coaching cheerleading, so I was able to work out with the cheerleaders and I even went to games with them and stayed active with them during my didactic year. So that was really easy, staying active and having an active stress relief from PA school, something to get my mind off PA school, my mind out of studying. So that was very therapeutic for me. And as far as overall health, I think that did wonders for me in my first year.
I don’t think my diet did too well. You’re up at like 3 am trying to study for that test, and you’re just trying to stay awake. You’re going to Einstein Bagels, that was by our class. And sitting in class for six hours is mind-numbing, so at least you can enjoy that delicious cinnamon bagel. So I don’t know if I did my best with staying active. But I think staying active and finding that downtime and finding that stress relief when you think everything is kind of coming down on you -- I think I did fairly well.
Savanna: Yeah the only reason I worked out was that two of my friends in PA school would go to the gym and basically make me go. And they would run and I was like “I'm not running, I will walk with you guys around the track, but I'm not running.” They would always try to get me into mud runs and 5K races. And I would refuse! Haha I'm glad they were my friends and still my friends. I'm very thankful that they encouraged me to do that, because it was a good stress relief.
Ashley: Yeah, and I think really managing your expectations on what healthy means to you at this point in time is important. Like having a raging six pack and a bikini body is probably not the best thing to think about in PA school. Maybe you don’t have the time to manage your diet and hit the gym like you are trying to compete in a bodybuilding competition or something. But really managing those expectations! Healthy means thriving in PA school, having the energy to study and having the energy to still maintain my relationships during this very stressful time in my life. So really digging deep, getting into your feelings, managing those expectations, what healthy means to you at the moment. I think that’s my number 1 tip is finding that stress relief and not allowing PA school to become all-consuming. Go out and have fun and find that stress relief. I think that could be the single most best thing you could do PA school.
Savanna: Yeah! And make time for yourself. Even in the sense of checking in with yourself and doing things that take care of you like eating. I have said it before, but I love reading and I didn’t read a single book for fun during PA school. And when my parents would invite me to get dinner with them I would say no and ask them to bring me something back. And by the time they came home, I would usually be asleep because I just didn’t eat dinner. And that's not healthy. That's not making good choices for yourself. And again, looking back, I can see that. I don't know about your class, but my class had a snack closet. That was our fundraiser. So they would go to Costco and buy all the snacks for the closet. And then we could get a candy bar for like 25 cents. I mean, it was great!
Ashley: That’s definitely the number 1 question you should ask when you interview at PA schools. Do you have a snack closet?
Savanna: I also remember that there were people in our class that would eat out every single meal. Like literally, they would bring Starbucks for breakfast. It was so expensive. They would go get something for lunch at the little cafe. And then they would all go out for dinner. And I was like how are you doing that? So expensive!
So, how'd you get into nutrition coaching? One of the things I love is when PAs have interests outside of being a PA.
Ashley: Well, I never would have guessed in a million years that I would do something like this. Obviously I'll obviously always have been interested in nutrition. I have a degree in nutrition, I was a college athlete, where health and nutrition and fitness was really important. So it's always been an interest and always just finding ways to incorporate healthy things into your life. Because I knew from the very beginning, even as a nutrition major, that good health and preventative health starts with what you eat, period, We even learned that a PA school about being healthy for preventating disease -- 90% diet 10% exercise. I’ve always kind of had a passion for that, especially because people in my family have chronic illness.
So during my post-partum period, I was lacking motivation. I was three months postpartum. I had a friend of mine, Lauren, who was a FASTer Way to Fat Loss. I had seen her posting, and kind of made fun of her. But I finally gave in because I was pretty much at a low point. I wasn’t making the best choices. Diet Coke was my best friend again. And basically every meal was refined sugar. I was like, “I’ve got to stop this. I felt miserable.” So I was overwhelmed at first, but after learning the strategies, it interested me even more. So I got onto PubMed and looked up articles on intermittent fasting. I was like, I think there is something to this. It was incredible. I was like, “whew, I think this is legit and this is real.” I mean, I wasn’t deprived. There wasn't a mean macro. There wasn't a macro that was eliminated or the “bad guy.” I felt like it was what I learned in nutrition. Everything in moderation. We have treats, we have carbs, we have fats. It was just a wonderful way to envelop everything people tell you into one system and one structure. So I loved it and eventually become a coach. And I’m a born teacher, a born coach. I love to do it; it’s my passion. So having nutrition, coaching, and preventative health all in one is a dream come true, honestly.
Savanna: We had an intermittent fasting lecture in PA school! I tried Whole 30, and that was awful. I tried it twice. The first time, I made it 15 days. The second time was when I was post-partum. I don’t know what was going on with my body, but it made me so sick. It was awful. I was waking up sick in the middle of the night. My husband was like “are you pregnant?” I wasn’t pregnant, like I didn’t know what was happening to me! I was doing it with my medical assistant at work. He's also one of my best friends. And I was like, “We're not doing this again. Not happening.” But I was like you, I was so desperate to not be squishy anymore, so I'm with you there because mine is 12 and a half months old.”
So overall, what is FASTer Way to Fat Loss about? Give us the breakdown about that.
Ashley: FASTer Way to Fat Loss is an online program that guides you through 6 pillars of the “FASTer Way”. The main one is intermittent fasting. Then you add in the others which makes it an awesome program altogether. But intermittent fasting, you have whole food nutrition, you have macros and macro tracking, carb cycling, strength training combined with HIIT, and then also accountability and community. You join an accountability group with me where I teach you and coach you through all the aspects. I teach you the metabolism of each macronutrient, why it is important to have them. I teach you why carb cycling is effective and what's happening metabolically in our bodies to show the results and the fat loss that we're having. We go over intermittent fasting, and what is happening inside our bodies and how intermittent fasting works with playing on our insulin levels and depleting our glycogen stores out of our liver, increasing apoptosis and cellular regeneration in our body. So I go through all of these things in the group, and I teach you how to put it together in cohesive flexible plan. It’s all online for 7 weeks and we have an accountability group. You have access to me daily with weekly trainings.
Savanna: Okay, so I’ll say what I liked about it. I like that you as a coach - you have a degree in nutrition and you’re a PA. You’re not a random person who decided to coach people on nutrition, which I feel like I see sometimes. And I'm like, wait, why are you qualified to do this? So, that was great! Also, I tried intermittent fasting for a little bit. And I always thought it would be really hard. But once I got in the groove, it really only took a few days for me to adjust. Also through the teaching, I felt like I understood my body better and what it needed and why, which was very helpful. Also, I told you this, but I did not stick to the rules very well, like I pretty much ate what fit my macros, even if it was like dairy or whatever. But I didn't feel deprived of anything. I felt like I was eating a lot.
Ashley: Yes, everyone says that!
Savanna: I think one of my problems was that I didn’t feel like I could eat enough. But I was still seeing change and losing weight. So it was really cool. Really interesting how all that works. And if someone decides to do this, planning ahead was key for me. I learned that if I don't plan ahead, I'm going to choose the easiest option, which is usually the closest option - which for me is either McDonalds or Zaxby's. I learned a lot doing it!
Ashley: Yeah, I think it's such a great mindset shift for people, especially people who come from the 90s and are scared of fats. And then people who come from keto land, and are scared of carbs. And I preach all the time, I don't think there's a bad macro! I think you just have to find what fits for you, what makes you feel good. So you go through this program and you’re telling me how you feel through the whole thing. If I don't know the answer, I'll go find it for you. I'll research it for you. I'll find somebody else that knows the answer. And we really just brainstorm to find something that works and feels good for you. Because at the end of the day, if I just tell you rules to follow and they are not flexible and not personalized to you, you're not going to thrive and you're not going to survive in a lifestyle like that. And then it's going to be pointless. So that’s what I really like about it as well. I'm a huge proponent of understanding how and why we do something, so you just feel so much more empowered to do it. It’s a lot easier to kind of stay on track that way. It’s nice also depending on where you are in your journey. If you're at maintenance, if you want to change this, change more composition here, it just all depends on where you are in your journey. It can be flexible to meet that need!
Savanna: So tell us more about where we can find you and ask you all the questions!
Ashley: Sure! Here is a link that goes to my page as well FASTer Way to Fat Loss page, and you will see me as a coach. And we'll talk more about our pillars, what to expect, what rounds look like, and a lot more information. Also, I share a lot of tips and information on my Instagram. That's probably the main place that you want to follow me and see what's going on: https://www.instagram.com/ashleyphillipsturner or @ashleyphillipsturner. I keep you up to date on when my rounds start and when you can register. I like to drive into the science and why with my posts and stories. I try to keep you up to date on the latest research too! I kind of go over some stuff like that.
Thank you so much for reading! I hope you found Ashley as endearing as I did.
